-Fernando Alonso grabs pole in dynamic wet/dry conditions, again!!!
-Fernando Alonso drives brilliantly, the only driver to score third win of the season, winning at Hockenheim!
-Lewis Hamilton stupid pass or brilliant overtake?
-Okay, what about Vettel’s pass on Button for second place on the podium?
-Wait, did you say Button on the podium? Is Jenson back?!
-Raikkonen sits 4th in the drivers championship, after a strong performance in Germany.
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116: German GP 12 [ 1:14:11 | 34.11 MB ] Play Now | Play in Popup | Download
13 thoughts on “F1Show 116: German Grand Prix 2012”
Great show guys, you really help my work Mondays go by quicker!
To weigh in on the Vettel – Button pass. This was an easy one for the stewards, Vettel left the track, taking all 4 wheels outside to make the pass, which is illegal. Many people have compared it to the Hamilton-Rosberg situation from Bahrain, but it is completely different. Yes, all four of Hamilton’s wheels were outside of the white line, but Rosberg (very aggressively) forced Hamilton off, leaving no room or nowhere for him to go. Button left Vettel plenty of room and did not force Vettel off, Vettel did that intentionally to gain an advantage. Good call by the stewards on that one.
I find it very odd that you seriously claim going on the outside of the corner in the dirt and marbles would give Vettel an advantage over going on the racing line. If there was any advantage at all to drive that line Vettel drove you would see drivers do it regularly, take Spa as an example, drivers will regularly go outside of the track limits to optimize their lap. As Vettel stated in the interview, he had no idea where Button was, it is INCREDIBLY common for drivers to push the other driver out of the track in the same situation, Vettel assumed Button would do so aswell.
He gained an advantage because he could continue accelerating. IF he were to follow the rules and only put two wheels over, he would have had to brake or at the very least, let off the gas and Button would have easily remained in front. You honestly believe Vettel had no idea where Button was? Did you believe Senna when he said he didn’t intentionally wreck Prost in Japan 1990? I like this statement “it is incredibly common for drivers push the other driver out of the track in the same situation, Vettel assumed Button would do so as well.” Yes, it is common. However, Button didn’t force Vettel out. IF Vettel made that assumption, he was way wrong. He, like every other driver wants to keep their speed and make as many passes as possible. Vettel has made many great overtakes, this one was just illegal and he paid the penalty for it.
So here you state that Button pushed Vettel of the track: “IF he were to follow the rules and only put two wheels over, he would have had to brake or at the very least, let off the gas and Button would have easily remained in front.”
And then here you contradict yourself: “However, Button didn’t force Vettel out. IF Vettel made that assumption, he was way wrong”
Also, there is no advantage in acceleration over the racing line, it’s THE RACING LINE.
Charlie Whiting clearly stated the rules, then warned the drivers about going off track at this circuit, after the other GP’s that weekend followed the quicker line (off track). Just ignore this fact.
100% disagree with you. Vettel obviously accelerated much quicker off the corner when side by side with Button (proof being he passed Button), and yes, this was quicker on the marbles and dirt. Just ignore this fact.
Button left Vettel room to have 2 wheels on track on that corner, this again, is a fact. Just ignore this as well.
If drivers were to always just take the quickest line, then there would be very few corners in F1! They take advantage of the safety features of the track (ie runoffs, and low kerbs), and then take advantage of the stewards, hoping they don’t pull them up.
Christian Horner etc on the wall made a big mistake not instructing Vettel to give the place back, he may well have passed Button legally later.
F1shift didn’t contradict himself.
At least with this talk of Button and Vettel, we might stop taking about Maldonado ……….. Hopefully.
“If drivers were to always just take the quickest line, then there would be very few corners in F1!”
I’m speechless, I wont bother arguing this anymore.
I’m saying that ‘tongue in cheek’ obviously ! There’s a faster line, that line is to straighten a corner out as much as possible, ie to straighten the corner. But there’s a rule that you can’t have all 4 wheels outside the white line, and this is especially the case when using runoffs and low kerbs to your advantage whilst overtaking.
Using the ‘sausage’ kerb that Massa broke his suspension on twice during the weekend would solve this corner cutting? Only thing is it a bit dangerous.
Taking this one point of 5 to not reply to any of my other points………..interesting.
Eric, I never contradicted myself. I never once stated Button forced Vettel off. You are just trying to find something in my argument that is incorrect and REALLY stretching for it. Again, Vettel had the advantage BECAUSE HE DID NOT HAVE TO STOP ACCELERATING. IF HE FOLLOWED THE RULES, HE WOULD HAVE HAD TO BRAKE OR AT LEAST LIFT, ALLOWING BUTTON TO STAY IN FRONT…anyways, I really don’t want to get into an argument with some person over the internet, so can we please end this. I understand you are probably a Vettel or Red Bull fan, but you have to realize his move was illegal and he gained an advantage by doing so.
Maldonardo did it…
Seriously though… Vetel was able to carry more speed accross the apex and into the corner exit by allowing his car to run wide (completly off the track).
Jensen gave Sebestian the reqired room.
For everyone who is claiming that Sebestain has been ‘wronged’ consider this, whould he have been able to pass Jensen with out running of the track? Would he have tried if, rather than a nice pice of tarmac there was a sand trap or grass or maybe a wall?
The way I like to imagine it is this, at the edge of the track there isn’t a run off area, there isn’t a gravel trap, there is a brick wall. If you leave the track you hit the wall. The lines denoting the confines of the track are there for a reason. Button didn’t push him wide, Vettel carried more speed by leaving the track. He should have braked and slotted in just behind Button.
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